Tag Archives: Setting Up Equipment

Problems Tuning Genesis Bows

QandA logoI get a lot of requests for help and I am glad to provide what I can. One of my readers upbraided me for this because I have been more than a little adamant that archery coaches shouldn’t “work for free.” So, I am being somewhat inconsistent. There are a couple of reasons I do this. For one, I am still trying to learn how to “coach remotely,” so I embrace opportunities to do that. Second, there is so much need for help in the archery coaching community. The main reason, though, is that people are turning to me because they can’t find the help they need. Not that that help isn’t available in every case but that it has been made hard to find. (I really, really, (really) wish the archery organizations would embrace coach support wholeheartedly instead of the current “train ‘em and drop ‘em” approach.) Until such resources are more widely available I will continue to do as much as I can to help those coaches who seek it.

Today’s topic comes from a reader of this blog who seeks help tuning Genesis bows. Here’s his email:

I’ve been darn near driving myself insane trying to learn to understand and tune a bow, specifically the Genesis.

A little background: I’m Level 2 certified wanting to do level 3. Just having trouble finding a training that’s close and works with my schedule having five kids of my own. I’ve read many of your books and in fact own 4-5 of them as resources for me and our coaches. We have a very large NASP program of 95+ in our elementary school from grades 4-6. We’ve been doing NASP for 5-6 years. We’ve won a team state championship in our second year and some individual championships. I’ve not done anything to the bows except yoke tuning and nock point tying 3/8˝ high of zero on a bow square and the occasional serving repair at the local archery shop. Perhaps I should be tying the nock even higher.

I’ve talked to other coaches and have picked up a few tips/suggestions regarding bow tuning and done far too many hours of research. Most coaches, since we’re competing against them, I believe are a bit guarded about sharing too much info. However, it seems almost all of our bows make arrows kick to the left for a RH archer no matter what I do.

For bows that seem to have cam lean I’ve tried rotating the bottom limbs, fiddled with the ATA length by twisting strings/cables, and replaced bushings in the cams. Regardless, I still see arrows kicking typically.

I realize that when pairing archers with bows that are not their own in a program it is not a one-size-fits-all situation. However about 50% of our archers have their own bows and I’d like to be able to tune them properly but cannot figure it out.

Also, once we begin shooting as a team we have enough bows for those who don’t own their own bows to each use one of ours thereby allowing us to individually tune. As NASP has grown it’s become more competitive and I’m wanting to keep up but feel we’re being left behind and want to keep our kids competitive and give them every chance possible to win. I’m willing to do whatever it takes we just don’t know what that is when it comes to bow tuning for the Genesis. If you understand these bows I’d be willing to pay you good money for a private bow-tech clinic if you’re ever in the area, not joking. 🙂

I just read the below link where you mention attaching a guide to bow and arrow fitting to the article regarding but don’t see the text document mentioned. Perhaps it would help. https://archerycoach.wordpress.com/2016/03/03/porpoising-and-fishtailing-follow-up-and-the-acg/

Any guidance or assistance is greatly appreciated!

And here is my response:

* * *

The document mentioned in that post was attached to the email sent to the correspondent, not the post. I have attached it to this email in the hope it might assist you.

Everything I am going to say from now on applies to right-handed bows. If you are dealing with a left-handed bow, you have to switch left and right. ;o)

Your kids arrows are flying to the left and you can’t tune it out because the arrows are too stiff. The “Genesis formula” (my term) is to make a bow and arrow combination that can be shot by a great many people. So the bow has zero letoff, which allows it to be shot by people with widely different draw lengths with no adjustment (not so with a bow with letoff) and an arrow that is too long and too stiff for people with short draw lengths so that it will be long enough and not too weak for people with longer draw lengths. But arrows that are too stiff for a particular situation will fly off to the left. Arrows that are too weak, will fly off to the right. (Remember that left and right directions have to be switched for left-handed archers.) Since most youths fall into the shorter draw length category, most arrows used for the Genesis (especially the “Genesis Arrow” are too stiff and will fly to the left no matter what you do to the bow.

This is because the farther you draw a bow, like this one, the more energy is stored in the bow. The more energy stored, the more energy is given to the arrow when shot and the stiffer the arrow needs to be to receive it. (Imagine a whippy thin arrow being shot from a very stout bow–the arrow might break upon release!)

“So, in tuning, we set up the bow and tune the arrow.”

So, in tuning, we set up the bow and tune the arrow. (Little tweaks of the bow may take place for fine tuning purposes, so this is just a generalization.)

The hard thing with kids is that they are still growing. If you fit them for arrows (see attachment) “correctly” they will over the next six months, grow an inch or half an inch and their draw length goes up accordingly and now they arrows are too short (for safety) and too weak (as the bow is now “stronger” because it is being pulled farther). What we recommend is to fit arrows to youth’s bows that are one spine group stiffer for each extra inch of length you choose. By choosing to use an arrow that is 2-3 inches longer than usual, if you didn’t choose a stiffer shaft, the arrow would be too weak. But with those stiffer shafts, when the youth grows and needs a stronger arrow, that extra length allows the arrows to be shortened (making them stiffer) while still being long enough for safety.

Standard bow setup for “fingers” shooters is to have the bottom of the top nock locator 1/2” above square. The purpose of this is to launch arrows a bit “nock high” to avoid clearance issues with the arrow rest. Genesis bows are not what one would call high precision bows, so some cam lean and other less desirable attributes are to be expected and really don’t contribute to your issues. The problems you are having are likely due to just arrow shaft stiffness mismatches.

I hope this helps.

Steve

PS We are working on a series of e-booklets explaining all of this and the attached document is to be part of that, from which we expect to make a little money ($1.99 per booklet?), so I ask that you don’t share the document SMFAwith your colleagues. Of course, if you learn the knowledge provided in it, you will be free to share that with your fellow coaches. ;o)

PPS We have done bow maintenance and tuning workshops before and we might be able to set something up if you would like (we are not so far from one another geographically). There are, however, people in your community who might be able to provide this service cheaper (we need to recover travel and lodging costs, etc.). The purpose of this e-booklet series mentioned above is to provide much of the information you need. I also strongly recommend the book “Simple Maintenance for Archery” by Allan Anderson and Ruth Rowe. It contains step-by-step instructions for many of the tasks need for tuning and maintenance (with photos!). It is now out in a second edition (photo is of first edition).

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Is it My Equipment, the Environment, or Me?

When experiencing problems in archery, the key question for archers is: is it my equipment, the environment (wind, rain, etc.) or me responsible for my misses. Since you cannot solve a problem you do not know you have, this is something coaches have to help with as often as not. Believing one has an equipment problem when it is really form/execution is to road to nowhere.

Consider the following story from my friend Tom Dorigatti, a compound bow guru:

Do you remember me telling you that a careless person in the range went running (and I do mean running) past my bow and knocked it flying some 15 feet onto the hard concrete floor? Do you also remember me telling you that the silly thing was just not shooting well, or holding well, and was tossing flyers at will high and/or low out of nowhere?

I put on a new Hamskea arrow rest (taken off my Merlin bow), I checked axles and cams for straightness/cracks, misalignment. I rechecked and checked my measurements again. I found nothing that should be causing this. I do not miss by 12˝ or more at 20 yards, period.

“Well, I went a step farther and took a large magnifying glass and went over that bow from stem to stern looking for anything that may be a crack, or break in the limbs and/or the riser. I found nothing.

I have no way of checking for a twisted riser, however. So, we were down to either a twisted riser or a failure somewhere on the bow that we/I couldn’t detect. I called up Darton and explained what exactly had happened to the bow. I explained how it wasn’t shooting for crap, and that I would like to send it in for them to check out for a twisted or cracked riser. I got an RA Number sent immediately.

From the time I sent the bow in until the time I got it back was 10 days. They had asked for an arrow that I was using out of the bow and how I set the bow for its paper tune. Of course, I tune a slight nock high right tear because bullet holes for me doesn’t cut it.

I called them back after about a week and asked if they’d found the problem. They had. That idiot who knocked the bow flying had splintered (not visibly) all four limbs on the bow! What was happening is the splinters were opening and closing at their will and state, and not consistent because they were failing worse as time went on.

“What is important for coaches to do is to listen to these stories.”

The riser was checked and it wasn’t bent or twisted. Darton replaced all four limbs on the bow, and set it back up to factory specifications, which so happens to be exactly where I had it set anyway! Of course, I checked all settings before even trying to shoot the bow, and I guess it was right by them, since they told me they checked the tune after they’d rebuilt the bow.

Now the thing shoots like it is supposed to and I’m not fighting the nose-dives and wild arrows. It is shooting as tightly (or a touch tighter) than I am able to hold, so I don’t have any complaints.

In spite of the fact that the bow had been “abused” (not my me, though), Darton replaced all four limbs, reset things, and sent it back at absolutely no charge to me.

I now have a bow that holds steady now, after months of fighting it and blaming myself. because of the “shake,” when all the while most all of it was broken/failing limbs. I was lucky … because those four limbs could have broken all at once at full draw and … that is not nice to think about!

My sight movement since I started shooting has always been an up and down movement. Rarely do I ever have a side to side swim of my sight. I don’t have very many left and right misses either. So, I should have known that there was something really out of kilter with the bow when it kept getting worse and worse as time went on. But, I blamed form, and that shake because I went through all the measurements of the bow and they were spot on.

My suspicions really arose when it got to the point I couldn’t find anything else. I knew I was fighting the bow constantly. I had a friend shoot the bow and he said he struggled to keep the bow up close to center; it was like he had to fight the bow to keep it from having the sight drop out the bottom, too.

Another thing that put me onto the bow being screwed up was paper testing. I always shoot six different arrows when paper testing, not just a single shaft. Who the heck knows, you could pick a good one or you could pick a bad one, but when all your arrows give the same tear, you know things are good. With the “broken” bow, I was getting several tears per my tune, then a wild nock right tear of 2-3˝, then back to a “normal tear” for a couple, then a another wild tear. And it wasn’t the same arrow each time. Sometimes I could get three or four in a row, and rarely five or all six. That finally convinced me that something on that bow was moving around or changing as the bow was being shot.

“So, coaches, keep your ears open. Ask questions of the story tellers. Keep mental notes.”

The reason I am sharing this long story with you is because it was a long story. Here was a very, very careful archer, an archer who documents his equipment very carefully, an archer who is very cognizant of his own shot details, and an archery who has loads of experience and it still took him a great while to finally come to grips with the real problem.

When recurve limbs have interior defects, they eventually show up as limbs that look deformed, but compound limbs are shorter and typically solid fiberglass and do not necessarily show signs of internal damage.

What is important for coaches to do is to listen to these stories. From them you can glean knowledge but also they can give you an appreciation of how hard it is to diagnose some equipment problems. Because Tom is such an experienced bow mechanic, it took him longer to eventually send it back to the manufacturer with a note “It’s broke, can you fix it?” It is a matter of pride for both Tom and I that we can fix almost anything that goes wrong with our gear and it can cost us time and money and effort to overcome this belief.

It is also important to listen to these stories for examples of good and bad behavior on the part of the manufacturers. Darton showed itself to be a quality company. I have had equally good service from other manufacturers. But when an archer has a bad experience with a seller or manufacturer, he then tells that story repeatedly for the rest of his life! This contributes a lot to a feeling of negativity floating around archery and it is nice to be able to note times in which a positive result happens.

So, coaches, keep your ears open. Ask questions of the story tellers. Keep mental notes. The deeper you get into coaching, the less obvious equipment problems become (the easy ones are detected and fixed easily). There aren’t any textbooks or training programs on how to help your student-archers with equipment problems … yet, so you have to find ways to educate yourself otherwise.

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Compound Letoff—More is Better, Right?

Letoff is what makes compound bows special. Without letoff, compound bows are just a mishmash of wheels and pulleys. But, with letoff, wow!

If you are unfamiliar with the concept, compound bows incorporate mechanical advantages to have the draw force of a bow ramp up faster than recurves and longbows and then when they reach “peak weight” the force drops off down to a much lower “holding weight” at full draw (see illustration). Because of that faster ramp up, the total energy stored in the bow is greater for a 40# compound bow than for a 40# recurve or 40# longbow, even with the force give-back from the peak weight to the bottom of “the valley.”

The most typical “letoff” is 65% but when they were introduced they were 30-40%, then 50% became popular, then 65%, and now bows with as high as 80% letoff can be purchased. The letoff percentage is how much of the draw force is taken off, so a 40% letoff would reduce the peak weight by 40% at full draw. A 60# compound bow with 67% letoff leaves the archer only holding 20# at full draw, twenty pounds! The other 40# or so has been thrown onto the cabling system so that, in effect, the limbs help pull one another.compound-draw-force-curve

So, being Americans, we think that if letoff is what makes a compound bow special, we want “to get me some more of that,” and the more the better.

Unfortunately this is not necessarily a good thing.

One can design a bow where there is almost 100% letoff and you would be under almost no strain from the draw at full draw. But for target archers this is definitely not a good thing. We want to have enough holding weight to get a clean launch of our arrows. Even with release aids, a very low holding weight (aka a high letoff) means that only a small force is needed to change the launch position of the rear end of the arrow. Therefore it is easier to mislaunch arrows. This is the same consideration with recurve archers who do not have enough draw force “in hand” to get cleanly off of the string. (The hardest bow I have on hand to shoot is a 10# recurve bow. Getting off that string cleanly is very difficult.)

Most compound target archers seem to have gravitated to about 65% letoff. I say “about” because exact letoff cannot be built into a bow. If you change draw weight, or brace height, or any number of things on a compound bow, you can change the letoff involved (not hugely, but some).

Hunters are more prone to use a bow having 80% letoff as they will only be taking a few shots, may have to shoot from an awkward position, have larger targets to hit, and may have to wait for a moving target to clear obstructing brush or turn for a clean shot. The extra letoff allows more time at full draw.

More time at full draw is the advantage of letoff. Because of the lessened strain on the archer at full draw, they have more time to align their bows correctly and then aim carefully. When peak bow weight happens at full draw, as it does with recurves and longbows, time at full draw is necessarily short and less care can be afforded.

 

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Bowstrings: A Quick Survey

I had a lesson the other day with one of my Olympic Recurve students and he was complaining that the bowstrings he bought for his 68˝ recurve bow produced brace heights that were too high, even with no twists. I asked if the strings had been “shot in” and he said they were.

Bowstrings made with modern materials need many fewer shots to temper them than do older materials (Dacron and earlier). The old rule of thumb was 100 shots were needed, now I would estimate 30-35 should be recurve_bow_stringsufficient. After any stretch has occurred, the string is twisted to create the desired brace height. But this process is of no help if the untwisted string is too short.

This situation reminded me that on many occasions when buying large numbers of bowstrings for archery programs that many, if not most, were too short, producing quite high brace heights. On beginner bows this is not so much of a problem, the only one I could think of is making sure the archer’s armguards were placed farther from the wrist to provide the protection necessary. But on recurve bows of serious archers …

So, here is my question (please respond with a comment):

Have you experienced buying commercial bowstrings that turned out to be too short for normal use?

Any wisdom you want to share regarding how you cope with this would be nice. (I make my own bowstrings, but this is not an option for most archers.)

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Central Plane ? of the Bow?

QandA logoI always assume I am being perfectly clear, but I get help from readers who write to me and tell me when I am not. This is something for which I am grateful as it helps me do a better job of explaining things. Here is a recent request for a clarification that I thought I should share.

On page 64 of The Principles of Coaching Archery, Vol. 1, you say that the sight aperture [should be] in the central plane of the bow (along with the bow string). I’m not sure what you mean by ‘sight aperture,’ and not sure about ‘central plane.’
“I’m assuming you don’t mean that the pin (or whatever) that is part of the sight should be obscured by the bow string. I shoot a bare longbow for practice, but I hunt with a compound bow that has a sight, and it wouldn’t do me much good if the pin were hidden by the bow string.

Here’s my response:

* * *

I usually ask whether you want the long answer or the short one, but …

If your bow is set up right (any of them), the bow string should share a plane with the riser. The riser, were it to be split in two slicing down its middle from top to bottom (from the archer’s viewpoint), that is what the “central plane” is. (If you have a metal riser, the screw holes on the back are in that plane so you can use them to visually check whether the bowstring is “in plane” in that it should line up with both screw holes. On recurve bows, before the advent of “adjustable limb pockets,” the string could be no other place. If you bought a bow and the string wasn’t aligned on the center of the riser, you sent it back. (If later, you acquired a twisted limb, then there is more than one problem involved.) Now that we can “adjust limbs in their pockets” I have seen bows with bow limbs tilted in the same direction, creating a situation that the bowstring was quite far from centrally located. These bows don’t shoot worth a darn if left that way.)

See how the bowstring ;ines up with the central plane of the riser, how the archer holds the bow vertically? All of these are needed criteria for repetitive accurate shooting.

See how the bowstring lines up with the central plane of the riser, how the archer holds the bow vertically? All of these are needed criteria for repetitive accurate shooting.

Ideally when the string is pulled back and let go it moves toward the riser in or near to that plane. The arrow needs to be set up so that it sits in or very near to that plane so that the string pushes it along the axis of the arrow. If the string pushes on the back of the arrow and the arrow is sideways to that plane the arrow will spin like a helicopter blade! So, a basic bow setup requires the string and arrow to sit in this same plane. The arrow should, if it is spined right, then fly in this same plane toward the target, which means the sight’s aperture (pin, ring, scope with dot, scope with a ring, whatever) must also be in that plane (dead center, please).

When I first work with an archer, one of the first things I check is whether his/her aperture is “in plane.” If it is not, they do not have a good tune. The equivalent, if you are shooting Barebow and using a point of aim aiming technique, is that your POAs need to be in a vertical plane with the target center (a 12 o’clock to 6 o’clock line through the X-ring is part of this plane which, interestingly, is the exact same plane we were just talking about). If your POA is to the left of that line to hit the center, then your arrows are too weak (assuming a RHed archer). If the POA is to the right of that line, your arrows are too stiff.

All of this is determined by bow design and by the fact that when an arrow flies the only force remaining on it is gravity, so the arrow moves up and down only (absent wind) after it is launched. If that arrow doesn’t start in the central plane as described, it will not end up in it and will not hit the center of the target.

If the bowstring were off-center on the bow, it would tend to twist the bow in your hand and also end up pushing your arrows in a direction other than down the length of your arrow shafts and so your arrows would be hippety-hopping all day long (fishtailing primarily).

I am in the process of pushing a “principles-based archery coaching” approach in which coaches can learn a few of these basic design/physical principles which then allow them to figure out what is going wrong with bow setups, no matter the situation. Ain’t there yet, but working on it.

As to hiding the sight aperture (pin, ring, scope with dot, scope with a ring, whatever) compound bows allow the use of a peep sight which allows you to look through the string and for other bows, it is important that the pupil of your aiming eye (the hole that lets the light in) is lined up along side the bowstring, tangent to that string, meaning as close to the “plane” as possible without having the string block your vision.

And, of course, when you shoot Barebow, there is no sight aperture to place correctly or incorrectly.

An Added Note Now that you have some idea of this central plane of a bow, can you now see why a bow sight’s sight bar (the vertical part when being used) has to be parallel to the central plane? If it is not, then when you move the aperture up and down to adjust for shots of different distances, you will also be moving the aperture left and right relative to that plane. This will create left and/or right misses depending on the angle of the sight bar (the amount of the miss will vary with the distance).

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The Relationship between Draw Weight and Stabilizer/Bow Weight

QandA logoI love it when I get questions I had never thought about before. When you learn a subject, it tends to channel one’s thoughts, thus avoiding questions that can challenge them, so it is good to consider such questions. The question that stimulated this flood of philosophical thinking was: “If I increase the draw weight of my bow should the weight of the stabilizer also be changed?”

* * *

At first this seemed like one of those questions beginning Olympic Recurve students ask that are inherently nonsensical, but this one is not.

The “stabilizer weight,” including how that weight is distributed, is primarily a matter of balancing the bow as well as resisting movements that can occur in the short amount of time the arrow is on the string and moving (~ 20 ms). (The long rod of a OR setup resists the bow from tilting up and down and twisting left and right, while the short rods resist the bow from rocking left and right or rotating around the axis of the long rod. About the only motion they don’t resist is movement along the axis of the long rod, which is normal and acceptable. Note, though, that the biggest source of movement resistance is the mass of the riser itself.) The draw weight is a matter of force applied to the string and riser by the archer. The weight of the stabilizer and bow is also a force but it is at roughly a right angle to the draw force … and the two do overlap some. (If you didn’t know that weight is a force, you weren’t paying attention in middle school science class.)

The deepest part of the grip of your bow (called the “pivot point”) is typically the midpoint of the length and mass of the bow. Your bow hand is mostly below that point so the bow draw force (created by your two hands and the musculature and skeleton between them) is pulling the bow back into your bow hand but also partly upward, too (like the way a construction crane works (see illustration and photo), the pull of a cable from the bottom causes the top of the other end of the crane to rise, including any weight attached to it). So, like the crane, the draw hand is supplying some of the upward force needed to hold the bow up against gravity. When you raise the draw force, you increase the amount of this effect and it is easier to hold the bow up at full draw, that is the bow “feels” slightly lighter. So, you could add more weight to your bow or take some off if it feels better, but there is no reason to try to compensate for the increased draw weight other than that.

The bridgework bit is like your bow arm. Pull on those cables and the arm will move up. (The draw force is the equivalent of the pull on the cables) And, yes, I know that the cables can also lift what is on the end of the hook without moving the arm, sheesh!

The bridgework bit in this crane is like your bow arm. Pull on those cables and the arm will move up. (The draw force is the equivalent of the pull on the cables.) And, yes, I know that the cables can also lift what is on the end of the hook without moving the arm, sheesh!

There should be no effect of the draw weight change on the feeling of balance at full draw, even though the strain you feel at full draw has gone up. That increase in strain is horizontal, not vertical. So, if your bow still feels nice and balanced, you are good to go.

The bow arm acts like the beam of the derrick, with the draw force being like the force acting through the cables. This produces a slight upward force at the bow hand which helps to hold the bow up.

The bow arm acts like the beam of the derrick, with the draw force being like the force acting through the cables. This produces a slight upward force at the bow hand which helps to hold the bow up.

Realize, though, that since your “back half” takes on part of the work of your “front half” as described above, once you let the string go, then it is harder for the front half (your bow arm specifically) to absorb the loss of help from the draw arm and “dropping your bow arm” after the shot becomes more of an issue. We do not want the bow arm to drop soon after the shot because of “normal variation”—sometimes the drop will occur later (no problem) and sometimes sooner. If the “sooner” instances involve cases in which the arrow is still attached to the string, the dropping bow will take the string and arrow with it and a low shot will occur (definitely a problem). The indicator for the form flaw “dropping your bow arm” is that low arrow hits points show up out of the blue, as we say.

 

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Should I Be Shooting from the Valley?

I got the following question from one of my students. It is about compound bow set up.

What is Coach Larry Wise talking about when he suggests “adjusting your draw length to shoot from the middle of the valley?” Is he saying you don’t want to be against the wall? Many of the new 2017 bows make big points about being able to adjust the hardness of the wall so why would you want not to be against the wall? Is there a way to adjust the draw length via twisting the string to put you in the middle of the valley? Doesn’t that also decrease the let-off?”

* * *

Here is my response:

Some Background for Coaches Not Compound Fluent Yet
The valley is jargon for the segment of the force-draw curve of a compound bow (see illustration) right at full draw. The force exerted by the bow drops steadily from peak weight until a minimum is hit at the “bottom of the valley” and then it skyrockets thereafter. Because the draw force increases so quickly after the valley is reached, it feels like one is pulling against an unmovable object like a wall, hence the jargon “the wall” for that segment of the FD curve (again, see the illustration).

compound-draw-force-curve

A generic compound bow force-draw curve.

Shooting from the “middle of the valley” was common advice back in the day of round wheel bows (aka “wheelies”). My mid-1990’s PSE Magnaflite bow had a 2˝ wide valley as an example. With the advent of high performance, dual-cam “speed bows” and one-cam bows, the valleys were so short that you had to be in the middle of the valley, whether you wanted to or not. With more moderate cams such as are on today’s bows, the middle of the valley is still the place to shoot from. You do not want to “pull hard against the stops” (PHATS). The PHATS strategy was invented, I believe, on the fly by an archer who was creeping at full draw as a way to prevent creeping. But Tom Dorigatti has shown in one of his more brilliant Archery Focus magazine articles that doing that (PHATS) results in draw lengths that vary by as much as a quarter of an inch creating more vertical dispersion in your arrow groups.

Larry’s argument, one that I subscribe to (it is hard not to agree with Larry), is that a key to performing well is being relaxed. PHATS disrupts any such relaxation you might muster and doesn’t provide anything of value. Larry teaches that you have to set your bow’s draw length so that you hit perfect full draw position when you are in the middle of the valley, and that you hold that position because it is your full draw position (draw elbow straight back behind arrow), not because the bow is preventing you from pulling farther. This allows you to relax and even though there is variation in all positions of your body from shot to shot, the minor variations in a comfortable feeling elbow position (at which point your elbow is on an arc pointing sideways to your arrow, so not affecting the draw length all that much) results in only small changes in draw length, which because you are near the center of the valley, result in the initial launch conditions of each arrow being virtually identical. (The FD curve is basically flat at the bottom of the valley, so if you move forward or back ever so slightly from the middle, the draw force soon to be acting on the arrow is essentially the same (again, see the illustration).

Regarding “Is there a way to adjust the draw length via twisting the string to put you in the middle of the valley? Doesn’t that also decrease the let-off?” Most bows only allow adjustments in draw length via modules, etc. in one half inch or one quarter inch increments (1/4˝-1/2˝). Pros won’t accept more than 1/16˝ error in their own draw length, so yes, you will have to twist strings and or cables to accomplish these. There are too many schemes to be able to state a generic process for doing so, but in general twisting cables makes for larger changes than twisting bow strings. And, yes, this does affect let-off but so do draw weight changes. The listed let-off of bows is determined at one particular draw length and weight and varies slightly when either of those variables is changed (see image as example).

kineticrave-owners-manual-2_page_7_image_0002The changes due to cable or string twisting/untwisting are so small as to change the let-off only a very small amount, so not to worry.

As to why manufacturers are offering “features” to adjust the feel of the Wall one is pulling against, I guess we shouldn’t criticize them from giving us what we are asking for. We should OTOH be more careful in what we are asking for.

Does this make any sense?

 

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Olympic Recurve Alignment

I have a right-handed Olympic Recurve student I am coaching remotely and he sent me a couple of videos and a question:

I’ve sent You two videos to your Dropbox; in the video that the camera is between me and the target you can see that after the release my string hand goes out to my right side instead of just going back. It means that I’m doing something wrong, right? Have you seen this happening before?

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Yes, it is called a “pluck” as one would pluck a string of a guitar or other stringed instrument. (The bow was probably the inspiration for stringed musical instruments.) At some time or other, every “fingers” archer (non-mechanical release archer) has to deal with this issue. If you are asking “have I noticed you doing this before?” as opposed to “have I ever noticed anyone doing this before?” the answer is yes in both cases. In your case, we have been working on other things and, in general, beginning archers are often “all over the place” meaning that they lack enough consistency to identify which things they are doing often enough to suggest correction.

The cause of plucking? If you would look at the video taken from in front (I say “toward” as in “toward the target”) and look at your rear elbow. It is sticking out to your right. Ideally placed it would be right behind the arrow in the central plane of the bow (the one with the arrow in it) or slightly past that position (around toward your back—see the diagram). Because your elbow is out to the right, the pull on the string is slightly out to the right also, but most importantly, your subconscious mind knows that just relaxing your string fingers from this position will not get your fingers enough out of the way of the string, so it tries to “help” by opening your hand slightly. (Your fingers can move in toward your palm much farther than they can move back away from being straight. In order to avoid the string, your fingers need to be “out of the way” and your subconscious mind evaluates how successful that process will be.) Since this hand opening must be done quickly, your subconscious mind overdoes this motion and your hand moves out away from your face. Unfortunately, the string follows this motion of your hand, to some extent, taking the rear end of the arrow out to the right, resulting in shots that go to the left of where you aimed. (Target Cue: if your arrows start hitting left of where they formerly did, plucking the string is a common cause. Learning to read targets is a skill necessary for progress and making corrections while competing.)

the-lines-of-archery-lo-res

In the right hand photo, the shoulder line of this Olympic Recurve archer can clearly be seen.

To fix this problem, your shoulders must adopt a slightly different position. We want a line across the top of your shoulder (called the shoulder line—see “The Lines of Archery”) to point at the bow. Currently, yours are pointing to the left of the bow. (Your rear shoulder cannot rotate your rear arm around to be pointing at the bow if your front shoulder does not have your bow arm lined up with your torso. Many times I find that these problems originate in the front shoulder more so than the rear.) Try turning your torso/front shoulder in toward the bow … slightly, and rotating your rear shoulder around toward your back more. This has the effect of lengthening your draw, so your current clicker position will have to be adjusted inward. But before you do adjust it, you can use your “old” clicker position for training. Stand up close to your target butt, and draw and shoot with your clicker on and your eyes closed. The goal is to slide through the clicker before you are ready to shoot by doing as instructed above. (Don’t shoot until you are ready; since the clicker is too far out, its “click” is not a correct signal to shoot.) When you can do this several times in a row, you can adjust your clicker … inward … and see if you can get your shot timing back. (Having someone watch how far your arrow point gets behind the clicker’s edge will help you figure out how far to adjust it, but you can do it a bit at a time with trial and error testing.) The clicker should only go off when you are in position … preferably a correct position.

force-triangle-finished

The “archer’s triangle”

What you are working on is the “alignment” of your upper body to the bow and when you get where you want to be, people will say you have “good line.” This is also what people are talking about when they mention “the archer’s triangle.” One side of the triangle (viewed from overhead) starting at the bow goes across both shoulders and is straight, thus your shoulders point to the bow.) Having “good line” is a prerequisite for consistent accuracy in Olympic Recurve because it means you are pulling directly away from the target (rather than away and out to the right as you currently are) and when you loose the string the string will go straight toward the bow and your hand will fly straight back along your face because that was the direction it was pulling, but only a small amount because your shoulders were in an extreme position. Monitoring where your hand moves upon release (it moves on its own, you don’t move it) is a way of affirming you had good full draw position/alignment. Since your position at full draw is very close to the limit of your range of motion in that situation, there is a very uncomfortable feeling in your back muscles just before release. This uncomfortable feeling is another part of “the feel of your shot” which helps you recognize the difference between doing it correctly and doing it incorrectly.

Sorry for the length of this response, but if you had focused on just keeping your hand close to your face, you would unlikely to be working on the correct source of the issue (your shoulder alignment).

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Getting Into the Swing of Archery

[Note I have been on vacation for the past several weeks, which is why there has been little posted here. Steve]

Recently I got an email from a student working to set up his first pair of V-bars, long rod, etc. Here’s his email:

I was trying to find the correct balance between the small rods and my stabilizer. In the end I had 20 grams on the right side and 70 on the left side. Does it seems normal to you? Isn’t it too much weight?

long-rod-w-vbars-setup

(Note This student is right-handed. If you are left-handed you need to reverse all left-right references. Also you need to know that a stabilizer system is used to improve: (a) steadiness and (b) balance, and very secondarily (c) excess vibration reduction.)

Since the sight is attached on the right side of your riser and the arrow rest/plunger, too, I would expect more weight to be needed on the left than the right side of your short rods to achieve balance. This assumes (and it may not be a good assumption) that the riser is balanced around its central plane (because of the “sight window” they tend to be “right heavy” if anything). (Obviously you don’t want to add so much weight that you struggle to hold the bow up!)

Here is a test. Have a friend stand in front of you as you draw (no arrow!) with your eyes closed. When you are at anchor, have her check to see if your bow is straight up and down. Do this a couple of times to see if it is repeatable. If it is, you are good to go. You want to be able to feel that your bow is straight up and down and gravity is your best reference for this (actually there are others).

Your bow doesn’t have to be straight up and down at full draw, it just has to be consistently located, but what is your reference for, say, 7 degrees off of plumb? Any angle other than 0 degrees off of plumb is hard to repeat.

If you can hold your bow vertically, and the string is in the same vertical plane as the center of the riser, the long rod, etc. and the sight bar (the vertical bit at the end of the extension bar of your sight) is parallel with that plane, you have the best setup. If the sight bar is at an angle to that plane, then as you move the aperture up and down, you are also moving it left and right! Not a recipe for success!

Image the plane of the screen you are viewing this on splits these risers perfectly in half. That is the central plane of the riser. Your limbs need to be centered on this plane, as is the sight aperture and your bowstring.

Imagine the plane of the screen you are viewing this on splits these risers perfectly in half. That is the central plane of the riser. Your limbs need to be centered on this plane, as does the sight aperture and your bowstring.

There have been people who built a “cant” (e.g. 7 degrees slant) into their full draw position. They wedged their sight to match this angle (so that its sight bar was vertical when the bow was held at that slight angle) because they felt that the canted bow was the most natural position for them. Few people do this. The point is the bow doesn’t have to be straight up and down, it just makes everything easier. My preference is to have everything perfectly plumb by having stabilizers, back weights, etc. to create a center of gravity lower than your hand and usually slightly forward of it to make your bow roll after the shot which allows us to feel that straight up and down position easier. To experience this, if you were to hold a hammer with the head up, the hammer is tippy, unstable, but if you hold it with the head down (just two fingers on the handle are needed) it is very stable … due to gravity). Having your bow set up this way (bottom heavier than the top), allows you to have the bow set its own position (vertically).

The idea behind setting your bow up to be front heavy as well allows for some post shot feedback. If you shoot a recurve bow when it is bare and if you have a relaxed bow hand, the top limb rocks back toward the archer after the shot. This is because the pivot point of the grip is the center of the bow vertically and you are holding the bow mostly on the bottom half, making it top heavy (you are also holding it where most of the mass of the riser and limbs is toward you which is why the top limb rotates down and back. In this case the center of gravity is behind and above the pivot point.

When a long rod stabilizer is fitted to a bow, recurve or compound, it causes the bow to rotate forward instead of backward (a small amount of weight placed far away has more leverage than a larger amount placed closer). So, after a shot occurs the bow rolls forward in your bow hand. If your hand is relaxed (key point) the bow is reacting to the forces acting on it at the moment of the string loose (gravity, the limbs changing positions, etc.). This “rollover” should occur the exact same way after each shot and thus is a gauge of whether you are being consistent. If the bow rolls differently after each shot you are being inconsistent. So, when a shot is made, beginners are looking at the target to see where their arrow hits. More advanced archers are paying attention to their bow’s reaction to the shot to see if it is consistent with the last and other previous shots. The arrow is launched; it will hit where it will hit. That’s what binoculars and spotting scopes are for. If you do not pay attention to your bow reaction, that information is lost into the past; no binoculars are powerful enough to see it.

As a coach, one of the things I do is watch the long rod of an archer (compound or recurve). From the moment of the string release, I expect to see the tip punch out a slight amount (~1 inch, 2-3 cm) due to recoil and then the stabilizer rotate straight down. If the archer is keeping their his/her arm up (not always the case), only his/her wrist bends as the bow goes through its “bow.” (The shot is not over until the bow takes a “bow.”)

When the bow is setup to be neutral (I believe Butch Johnson of the US shot this way), the bow doesn’t roll, it just keeps its position. But a slight shift of the bow, up or down, left or right, isn’t easy to see or feel under these circumstances. The sweeping arc of a rotating long rod is easier to see and feel as it acts as an amplifier of those small variations. This is feedback that is very valuable which is why I recommend you never to anything like a “bow hand release” which simply adds forces that have nothing to do with the shot into the mix.

Setting up stabilizer systems is all about feel. My preference is to set everything up for a vertical hold and then if I don’t like the feel so much, I adjust the grip to give me the feel I want. (At one point I bought a stationary belt sander primarily to make such adjustments.)

 

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Arrow Shaft Lengths: Some Ins and Outs

I have just been corresponding with a student regarding arrow shaft lengths. He was ordering Easton arrows and using currently available data charts from Easton. What he found, though, was that he was ordering his arrows “uncut” but the arrows he had made were ½˝ longer than the numbers indicated. After going back and forth about the topic of “arrow lengths” we didn’t resolve the difference.

Here are some different aspects of arrow length:
Shaft Length In Easton’s catalog if you find this listed it is the length of the shaft alone.
Arrow Length Most people measure from the bottom of the nock groove (where the string touches) to the end of the shaft. This is also called a “cut length.”
Total Arrow Length For front of center (FOC) calculations and some computer sight mark programs, the arrow is measured from the bottom of the nock groove to the tip of the arrow’s point. Some even include the full length of the nock.
The kicker is that these measurements go under quite a few different names. Argh.

Since I know that Easton has changed the lengths of some of their shafts without notice, I grabbed an arrow off of the shelf, an Easton 2013 Platinum Plus arrow and measured just the shaft. It measured 32.5˝. I picked up the current Lancaster Archery Supply catalog and it had a chart that listed that shaft at 32˝. So, I looked back at a LAS catalog from several years ago (about when that arrow was purchased) and it listed the shaft at 32.5˝. Bingo. A change had been made. And unlike software that tells you (or at least lists) all of the differences from the previous version when an upgrade is installed, this doesn’t happen in archery.

Even when you know what is going on, it doesn’t mean you know what is going on. And you need to keep in mind that distributors buy thousands of shafts at a time, and some may not have good inventory control (which has rules like sell the older stock first, just like at the greengrocers!) and they may even have some “new” and “old” stock mixed in their bins.

Serious competitive archers have arrow saws and cut their own arrow shafts, then assemble them. The final length is the result of a tuning process, not something one looks up in a chart. If you don’t have the tools to cut arrow shafts, melt point cement, own a jig (or five) for fletching, etc. you are at a disadvantage as a competitor and as a coach. These are things that friends had when I got started but it was clear I needed my own tools (I am doing some fletching for a friend right now). And the above situation is one of the reasons.

Welcome to the wonderful world of archery equipment!

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PS I am working on, amongst myriad other things, a series of pamphlets that cover these equipment issues. My goal is to provide these as e-pamphlets that you can carry around with you on your smart phone to consult as you need to. Until then I still recommend the wonderful book Simple Maintenance for Archery by Rowe and Anderson.

PPS If you haven’t noticed it Easton has made some rather large changes in its recurve target spine chart. If you are buying Easton arrows, you should use nothing older than the 2016 chart.

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